poet682006

Try drawing logical conclusions. I relalise logic isn't taught in the modern school systems but you might want to check it out. More succinctly, neither YOU nor I nor anybody can predict for one second how ANY of these hypothetcal matchups would turn out regardless of era. Unless, of course, you think you're omnicient, but somehow I doubt that's the case.

Poet

TommyGunn

l like to deal with facts poet and the facts are there for all to see, marciano was 5`10, 190lb. lewis was 6ft5 and weighed around 240-250, theres no if's or buts about it rocky wouldn't have been able to live with the sheer size of some of the giants, i doubt he'd even be able to get past the jab of a larry holmes or lennox lewis.

bill1234

Another thing people don't seem to bring up is, fighters from 40 years on back, their muscle were built to go, not for show. They tried best they could, not to get very muscular. They still had plenty of muscle, they just had the perfect amount of muscle to fight a 15+ round fight. The last guy built like that was Holmes. In his prime he weighed a lean 209. Frazier in his prime weighed 205. Ali weighed 212. Louis weighed 199. Holyfield had a lot of wasted muscle, but he still wasn't that heavy. Marciano was 5'10-5'11, and he weighed 185-190. Joe Frazier was 5'11, and weighed 200-205. Joe had a little bit of fat on him, where as Marciano had none. Thats another thing, fat. Look at todays heavies, they are fat slobs, that can barely go 12 rounds with out an oxygen tank and clinching for 1/2 of the fight. Guys 30 years ago wouldn't even think about clinching if they weren't tired or hurt, or just tieing them up to shove them away right after.

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hhascup

I agree to the most part, BUT Lewis didn't have any fat on him, either does the Klitschko brothers. I met and even announced or introduced these three Giants and they were in shape to say the least.

SugarShane

Thank you *applause* How right you are. Bill quit using oldschool quotes to defend the old fighters. You need to see more new fights buddy. The sport has evolved. Look at old Football/Basketball/Baseball. The teams of today would beat the hell out of the old ones. Guys are bigger, faster, smarter, and know more about the sport they are involved in. This argument will never die.

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bill1234

They are bigger, not faster, only smarter because they went to school. Don't forget they have steroids and other stuff like that today, all they had was hard work.

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bill1234

I know they don't/didn't have any fat on them either, but they also have useless muscle. They would be just as strong if they dropped 10, 15lbs.

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poet682006

If you like to deal with facts you're in the wrong business. Any hypothetical matchup between fighters who have never fought is an exercise in guesses and opinions not empirical facts. Your opinion is no more valid than anyone else's and claiming your opinions are "facts" do not make them so. In order to take these disscusions beyond the hypothetical and into the realm of facts the two fighters would need to be actually put in the ring to fight it out. No other way is scientifically valid. My hypothothis isn't any less valid than yours.....unless, of course, you think only YOUR opinions are valid.

Poet

SugarShane

Oh how correct you are. This whole past/present debate is a hypothetical, never-ending BLAH! It will never be resolved or concluded. In my opinion the guys of recent years are superior to the majority of guys in the past, but that is just my opinion. Damn, I wish Tyson could fight Marciano and several other fights.

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hhascup

We all have our own opinions on this and that is what makes this sport so GREAT. I have no idea what anyone on this sites background is on boxing, BUT I always listen to everyone. That is the only way you learn.

When I asked Bert Sugar how come he changed his all-time ratings, he stated because he listens to what others have to say.

Over the years, I have received countless amount of calls, letters, E-Mails from Sports Writers all over the country for information. I not only give them the information on boxing but on all sports as well. You can just "Google" my name (Henry Hascup) if you wish.

I am not saying that I know more then anyone on this site, BUT I do have a background. I am a charter member of IBRO, which started back in 1983. I have researched or worked with Herb Goldman, Bert Sugar as well as many other boxing experts and historians.

My point is that no one knows for sure how one boxer would do against another, especially from different era's. It's all up for debate and I really enjoy debating this with all of you and I have to stand by what I have stated in the past.