Pound for Pound who do you think was the best fighter ever?
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'Sugar Ray Robinson'... that's where the "POUND FOR POUND" term came from!
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"Sweet Pea"
He won at 5 differnt weight classes.
He won at 5 differnt weight classes.
How does a foul make Ali any worse or any better p4p. Some people claim jordan traveled and the refs didn't call it does that mean that he wasnt the greatest basketball player ever?bill1234 said:
The competition Ali and Marciano faced was very different both in size and ability. Plus dont forget no one ever saw Ali in his prime, we missed out on what would have been three of his best years.
p4p greats
Robinson
Ali
& maybe just maybe
Pritty Boy Floyd Mayweather
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Sugar Ray Robinson
Although I love the brawlers/sluggers... Sugar Ray Robinson was the best "boxer" I have ever seen... so quick... so fit... and didn't just rely on brut strength to beat his opponents... but rather on "actual boxing skills!"
Although I love the brawlers/sluggers... Sugar Ray Robinson was the best "boxer" I have ever seen... so quick... so fit... and didn't just rely on brut strength to beat his opponents... but rather on "actual boxing skills!"
Call me crazy, but Sugar Ray Robinson was overrated. He did have some speed, agility, and power, but he didn't have anything that majorly up showed Ray Leonard or Sandyy Saddler. Leonard had better speed and agility, Saddler had a lot more power.
I would say Sugar Ray Robinson ... is the greatest all-around fighter of all time. He could do it all. He could box, punch, and had superior defense and other amazing skills. He could knock you out going backwards, like he did with Gene Fullmer.bill1234 said:
I doubt if we'll get fighters like Sugar Ray again.
JCC
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JCC said:
Ray Robinson started in the light weight dv. He climbed to the middle weight dv, and was still knocking people out
Robinson was awsome
A friend in Florida had once told me that back when he was just a kid ... back in the 1960's I think it was .. I'm not sure. Any way, I think it was at that time. He was at an arena with his dad ... I think .. and was watching the fights.tommygunn said:
And Sugar Ray (Robinson) came into the arena ... and suddenly the whole arena turned quiet .. as Sugar Ray's presence became known in the arena... and he said even the fighters in the ring .. seem to be distracted by it too.
It was out of respect ... you see.
You mentioned Ali?
I heard that when Ali, was a youngster that he had partically idolized Sugar Ray, and when Ali ... became a fighter he tryed to pattern himself after Sugar Ray.
The more you learn about Sugar Ray (and perhaps to have not been around or to have been too young to have never seen his fights) .. go do some research and learn about him. And you'll find out just how great a fighter .. and how great a man he really had been.
I don't think there is likely any old school handlers or trainers ... that are still around today, including boxing historians that if asked who was the greatest all-around fighter of all time that wouldn't most likely say it was Sugar Ray Robinson.
I tend to believe Ali may would mostly likely say that about Sugar Ray too. I think he would likely tell you that too. I'm almost certian that he likely would.
JCC
First off, I don't think your crazy!bill1234 said:
Secondly, all those guys you mentioned Sandy Saddler and Sugar Ray Leonard were both really great fighters and there can be no question about that at all. But so was Sugar Ray Leonard too.
Now I just want to say this ... often when guys take up boxing when they are young, even very age ... it was when I did and to box amateur ... tend to be focused as if it's all about power and speed ... and this kind of thing, just as I had once been too.
I remember one day in the gym ... back a lot of years ago ... and after I had some fights .. and was winning and had started thinking ... I was really a tough guy.
Well, one day, my trainer ... put some old guy in the ring with me to spar with ... he was some old guy .. who wasn't boxing any more. But for whatever reason ... my trainer chose for him to be my sparring that day.
I think the guy must have been just an old friend of his who use to box with him many years ago .. and maybe he just came to visit my trainer his friend at the gym that day.
Well, the guy didn't look to me like much, or that he could probably do much ... and he was an old guy, you know. And he didn't really look to me like he was in all that good a shape either. But in the ring, sparring in the gym that night ... he really gave me a hard time .. I mean a REALLY hard time.
And that's when my real learning begun ... as a fighter.
Boxing isn't so much about power and speed ... though those things are all good. And youth is a tool. And that's good.
But it's strategy! It knowledge! It's focus! Its more about skill ... not brute strength and speed.
For example, any fool can throw a punch!
But it takes skill to make a guy miss punches, and it's a mind game ... and you first have to out think him.
If your strong, make him think your weak.
If you weak, make him think your strong.
Make him miss enough punches and pretty soon he starts losing confidence ... and may start thinking he can't beat you. He may start to get scared ... and hold back.
And if he can't take a punch, or even if he can take a punch ... you hit him hard enough, and it may make a coward out of him. He may start thinking that he can't beat you.
And learned moves in the ring, about how to knock his timing, and things like that. And sometimes got to give him something to aim at to set him up, and he throws the punch you were wanting him too .. then you bang him! That's so much to learn.
It's a mind game, and it's more about skill not power and speed. But those things are good too.
For example, Mike Tyson ... I began once to notice about him that whenever he did get hit with a punch that did hurt him, he had a tendency, to stop throwing combitnations punches after that ... and had a tendency to start holding back ... and start throwing only one punch at a time.
Tyson had heart alright, but did he have as much as he pretended to have? .. or had been hyped to have had?
This is not intended to knock Tyson ... he was a real tough fighter and world champion, but only to make a point is all.
Nor, is this intended to be a criticism either.
JCC
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Robinson or Archie Moore, just look at their total knockouts
You bet!The Auctioneer said:
Because there's so much talk here on the board in places and mention of the Rock ... the great and legendary Rocky Marciano ... my favorite fighter .. and as for Sugar Ray Robinson the fighter I most most admire. I'll just mention that when Archie Moore .. went into the fight with Marciano ... he was an old guy ... by that time as a fighter at 38 years of age ... at 5'11" he weighed in for that fight at 188 lbs and had been the light heavyweight champion of the world and with a professional record going into that fight of 114 (fights)-- 19 (losses), with 83 Ko's and 5 draws ... and he was one hellavua fighter and a real classy fighter too.
It was no easy fight for the younger Rocky Marciano either. I was too young then to have seen the fight when it took place ... but I have a tape of that fight .. round per round of the whole fight ... and Moore took him down in an early round with a good left hook .. and by Marciano's own admitance ... Moore was very hard for Marciano to hit with single punches and he make Marciano miss a lot of punches in that fight .. and I noticed that on the tape of the fight as well. Ultimately, Marciano won the fight by a knockout in a late round ... Moore was of course was an old guy, and I saw he was getting tired. But it was a really good fight! And was not easy fight for Marciano at all.
JCC
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