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The greatest of all time

1841 Views 19 Replies 8 Participants Last post by  bill1234, 
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Who do you think the greatest boxer of all time was? In my mind it sure as heck WAS NOT MUHAMMAD ALI!!! It wasn't Ali because he won some decion's just because he was Ali. He didn't go undefeated. Just because he calls himself the greatest doesn't mean he is the greatest. If I called my self the president of the United States does that make me president of the united states NO!!! Of course it doesn't. In Ali's case he called himself the greatest and people wrongfully believed him. Don't get me wrong Ali was good, he was darn good, but not the greatest. If anyone at all deserves to be the greatest it is Rocky Maraciano "the Brockton Blockbuster." He deservesit most of all because he went undefeated, thats right you heard me UNDEFEATED!!! His final record is 49 wins, 0 lost, 0 draws, 0 nocontests, 0 nodecions, 43 Knock outs. He was only knocked dow twice in his 49 fights, once against Jersey Joe Walcot in their first fight (Marciano went on to KO Walcot in the 13th round) and in his last fight against Archie Moore, (Marciano went on to KO Moore in the 9th round). Marciano was a slugger. He stood toe to toe with you and wouldn't even think about going backwards. He was very short for a heavywight standing at 5ft 10in tall, he had the shortest arms of any Heavyweight champion he had a reach of 68 inches, thats only 34 inches each arm. Despite being short and having short arms he was the hardest hitting fighter ever! He would fight anyone anywhere anytime. Thats my reasoning if anyone should be called the greatest of all time it should be Rocky Marciano. Do you agree if not who do you think was the greatest of all time?:cool:
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He certaintly is up there on the list. I would probably say my "favorite" is Sugar Ray Robinson. This guy fought more fights in 2years than most pros do in a career. He finished his career with 200 fights 173-19-6 with 108 KO's !!

As far as tough goes, there were none tougher than the Rock. Marciano had unbelievable heart and a fabulous chin.
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Robinson was a one tough cookie but I don't have him as the greatest. Now that I'v thought about nobody truly is "the greatest":cool: because your only 1 punch away from victory or defeat.
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Greatest

This I think is agreat unanswerable question.I think you need to look at this with some respect to era,length of career,and quality of opponents.Marciano was great no question,but did he fight at different weights like others? or did he fight anyone or was he selective.Take a look at Archie Moore's record for instance,which I'll get in a moment, but that spanned several years at different weights,with a tremendus variety of opponents.Same with Sugar Ray Robinson.Its tough to compare with the likes of Leonard,Duran,J.C. Chavez,Delahoya. Just what are the requirements for not just the greatest of all time but up there in the top ten of any group.......I think length of career,and ability to fight up or down plays a factor......What about the mentle pressure of carrying the tittle? For instance Tyson's in- ability to not let the outside world affect his game. So the greatest maybe should have a mentle componet as well.This only makes me appreciate Ali a little more because of the overwhelming pressure he put on himself as well as the rest of the world,and still succeeded.....
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Sorry Auctie, but I have to go along with Bill1234...

The Auctioneer said:
This I think is agreat unanswerable question.I think you need to look at this with some respect to era,length of career,and quality of opponents.Marciano was great no question,but did he fight at different weights like others? or did he fight anyone or was he selective.Take a look at Archie Moore's record for instance,which I'll get in a moment, but that spanned several years at different weights,with a tremendus variety of opponents.Same with Sugar Ray Robinson.Its tough to compare with the likes of Leonard,Duran,J.C. Chavez,Delahoya. Just what are the requirements for not just the greatest of all time but up there in the top ten of any group.......I think length of career,and ability to fight up or down plays a factor......What about the mentle pressure of carrying the tittle? For instance Tyson's in- ability to not let the outside world affect his game. So the greatest maybe should have a mentle componet as well.This only makes me appreciate Ali a little more because of the overwhelming pressure he put on himself as well as the rest of the world,and still succeeded.....
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What is to be understood as the greatest? If we sum up all the particulars of the fighter than Ali or Tyson don't qualify.

Ali, the dirtiest fighter. He got away with almost all of his tricks and even the referies many times times looked away.

Tyson an incorregible brat in and out of the ring and also dirty fighter.

MARCIANO? YES.
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Kerubi is 100% right!:cool: :thumbsup:
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Greatest

I guess for me its by division now.Who's to say that only the greatest can come out of the Heavy weight division?There is something to be said for the old school guys who fought over 20 years and over 100 bouts.and in multiple divisions.

Tyson will never be in my top ten for greatest.!!!!


ok ok ok how about this,we put up a post for your top ten all time in each division you wish. then we take a poll on fighter of the century 1900-2000

That would be very interesting and an eye opener to some, including me
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kerubee said:
What is to be understood as the greatest? If we sum up all the particulars of the fighter than Ali or Tyson don't qualify.

Ali, the dirtiest fighter. He got away with almost all of his tricks and even the referies many times times looked away.

Tyson an incorregible brat in and out of the ring and also dirty fighter.

MARCIANO? YES.
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By the way I loved the "incorregable brat'. That was good
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Tyson's not in my top 10 either.:cool:
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I would say Rocky Marciano was a great boxer, better than Muhammed Ali, IMO. I would say he is the greatest of all time but saying this is just my opionion. This question is unanswerable, I agree.
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i am not a historian (i hope i spelled right)
that said
in my life time to date.
IRON MIKE TYSON hands down
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How can anyone say Tyson out of all people was the greatest? He had a glass jaw he could throw a punch but not take one. Marciano would have Knocked him Out in less then 5 rounds. Marciano could throw a bigger punch and could take an excellent punch. Marciano would have hit Tyson with a right and Tyson would go down. All Marciano would do is slug it out with Tyson, Tyson couldn't slug it out with Marciano.
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Yeah I kinda agree with Bill. I mean The young Tyson with Cus D'mato was pretty impressive. But it was all down hill after that in & out of the ring.
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bill1234 said:
How can anyone say Tyson out of all people was the greatest? He had a glass jaw he could throw a punch but not take one. Marciano would have Knocked him Out in less then 5 rounds. Marciano could throw a bigger punch and could take an excellent punch. Marciano would have hit Tyson with a right and Tyson would go down. All Marciano would do is slug it out with Tyson, Tyson couldn't slug it out with Marciano.
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"i am not a historian (i hope i spelled right)
that said
in my life time to date.
IRON MIKE TYSON hands down"

i was born in 1974 and i really started watching boxing in 1980.
i hope this clears it up for you.

its really hard to say this is the best. as the game has changed over the years.

that said again.
IMO IRON MIKE TYSON handsdown is the best.
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Inhis prime Holmes would have cleaned Tyson's clock. When Holmes fought Tyson in 88 Holmes was 38 years old and it was his first fight in three years. In their primes Holmes would have jabed Tyson to a pulp. Larry would stay out of range and jab. Tyson would get frustrated and give up, or start swing wildly. Holmes take advantage of Tyson's sloppiness (i spelled that wrong i know) and would start to nail him with a lot more punches.
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bill1234 said:
Inhis prime Holmes would have cleaned Tyson's clock. When Holmes fought Tyson in 88 Holmes was 38 years old and it was his first fight in three years. In their primes Holmes would have jabed Tyson to a pulp. Larry would stay out of range and jab. Tyson would get frustrated and give up, or start swing wildly. Holmes take advantage of Tyson's sloppiness (i spelled that wrong i know) and would start to nail him with a lot more punches.
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That's it! You just put it right!

We have to admit that Tyson never had it like a Joe Frazier. Frazier defined Ali's MO. I guess Mike never studied Holmes style. Joe knew how to get inside, neutralizing Ali's jab, probably take a punch or two than would deliver his "over head" and Ali would be in trouble.

For Tyson to be considered the gratest it would have needed much more school in boxing. Buster Douglas changed his life in the ring when Tyson was still young in boxing.

MARCIANO, YES.
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statisticly rocky marciano is the best but weighing only 15 and a half stone i dont think he was big enough to fight with the guys from the 60s and todays guys. i personaly would go for ali, because of the trouble he had in his life and the way he came back from this. look at liston just before clay beat him this guy was more feared than tyson was in his prime and he hardly touched ali in the two fights they had together. i look at ali in two diffrent ways, before he was baned from fighting he was the greatest of all time then after his ban he took more punishment and became a warrior which nobody thought he was. when you roll the 2 into 1 you get in my opinion the best fighter who ever lived on gods green earth.
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All Ali had was his speed, foot work, ability to dodge punches, and ability to take a punch. Everyone beleived Ali when he called himself the greatest after he KO'd Liston in the 8th in their 1st fight. Marciano used his short heit to his advantage. He would duck really low down and use all of his leg strength to launch himself upright and nail the guy with all of that power. Marciano was beating guys 6'2, 6'3, which was the average heit for the heavyweights in the 60's. So don't say Marciano was to short, he had the most power ever. Look at the picture under my name, I know its not clear but that was Jersey Joe Walcot, in their first fight Marciano was behind on the score cards do to him being knocked down in the first. Marciano knocked out walcott in the 13th with a huge right hand. Walcot was out cold for several minutes after wards. Marciano would have beat Ali/Clay by KO because Ali has never been hit with a punch as strong as Marcianos "Susie Q" (his straight right/haymaker) that would KO Ali for sure.
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I am no at all surprised by someone born in 1980 thinks that Tyson was the greatest.By simple exposure you saw a boxer with explosive power! So, Dave, as you expand your boxing horizon be open minded enough to allow the records and styles speak for them selves.I remember when everyone talked about how George Foreman was unbeatable and that he never went past the fith round and was the favorite new" greatest",until he met an expierenced fighter with some talent that put george on his ass. And Then came Larry Holmes who had power and skill. I am sorry but Iron Mike wont stand up to the test of time with some of the other Hvy wts as far as the greatest is concerened.
He sure did do wonders for ppv.He sure did generate ticket sales even late in his career. He will still have a big place in boxing history no doubt.
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It was the same story with Liston, the Auctioneer is right.
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